I know that some of you have had or are planning on having unassisted births of your own at home. I had a woman contact me today from my website and though she knew I am not a midwife, she thought that I would still be able to be at a homebirth that was unassisted by a midwife or dr. She thought that doulas would be trained for emergency situations should something go wrong at her birth. I explained all that a doula does and does not do but told her that I strongly suggested that she as least TALK to a midwife from a liability standpoint for me. I told her that i could not attend an unassisted birth for liability reasons as well. I was hoping that some of you could give me some info to pass along to her about unassisted homebirths because, in her words, she said she feels like she can do it herself and and doesn'e need a midwife. I tried to help her understand that most midwives are pretty hands-off and will let you labor the way you want. I would LOVE to attend a home birth...but I just don't think I'm comfortable with an unassisted, as TOTALLY amazing as it would be! (honestly, I'm bummed that I can't do that!) Oh, this is her 3rd baby and her previous two were medicated and she hated the meds
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ash
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I personally am completely against unassisted births. Accidents happen but to purposely plan one, I am not comfortable with. So as a doula I would say no on attending an unassisted birth, and giving any medical advice except having a midwife assisted birth.
Billie TX
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She thought that doulas would be trained for emergency situations should something go wrong at her birth.
Thats a warning sign for me - she really doesn't know what doulas do, and possibly is still looking for a hands-off midwife-type person to be there, just in case. It makes me think she isn't really ready psychologically for a UC yet. If she wants someone trained to deal with emergency situations she ought to just get a midwife. Its not the job of a doula.
Quote:
Originally Posted by naturalbirther
I was hoping that some of you could give me some info to pass along to her about unassisted homebirths because, in her words, she said she feels like she can do it herself and and doesn't need a midwife.
Other than that, I read the following books:
Special Delivery by Rahima Baldwin
Emergency Childbirth by by Gregory White
and Spiritual Midwifery by Ina May Gaskin to know how to deal with complications.
Quote:
Originally Posted by naturalbirther
I tried to help her understand that most midwives are pretty hands-off and will let you labor the way you want.
Thats not true, unfortunately. Midwives these days, the more they get licensed the more they practice with a CYA attitude. There are good midwives out there, but they may not be in your area. And being "hands-off" is sometimes not the point. A practitioner, who is not someone you are normally intimate with is an intervention in and of itself and can inhibit labor. Thats the reason some people UC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by naturalbirther
I would LOVE to attend a home birth...but I just don't think I'm comfortable with an unassisted, as TOTALLY amazing as it would be!
I personally think its completely OK for you to not be comfortable with attending a UC. It doesn't offend me at all. I'm not sure I'd attend another woman's. But I don't think you need to push her to talk to a midwife to protect yourself. Thats not your responsibility.
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I think unassisted births are normal and natural. I think that women who give birth that naturally are brave and strong.People have done it for hundreds of years. But from a Doulas standpoint I would feel uncomfortable attending the birth, unless I had something from her in writing that stated,I was not going to assist in the actual delivery of the baby. Make it clear to her that it is out of your scope of practice.And that if there seems to be a problem you will call 911. Unassisted birthers need labor support just as much as anybody. From a liability standpoint you cant get in trouble if you are not assisting in the birth and are only there to support her in labor.It is her choice th birth without medical attention. So it should fall on her shouldes if there is a problem.It would be similar to a situation where a couple doesn't make it to the hospital in time ( fast labor)and you end up catching the baby, as long as you tell them you are not a profesional and call 911 you are OK.
I think Doulas should try and support women in all birthing situations but only up to the point you feel comfortable .
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I don't know if I would attend a UC, because PA is one of those freaky 'alegal' states. Fortunately, we have midwives who are hands off lol. Why does she want a UC? If she had meds for her first 2 births, that makes me think she really wants a hands off birth and not necessarily a UC. I'd talk with her more probably. And, Rosy, is that pic of Jack? It's a beautiful picture
Oh, this is her 3rd baby and her previous two were medicated and she hated the meds
This to me is a huge red flag, it sounds like a very big leap from her previous births to UC....To me it does not sound like she is ready to commit to UC, which is fine, but maybe there is a happy medium for her between UC and a very medicated birth. Just my two cents...
From a liability standpoint you cant get in trouble if you are not assisting in the birth and are only there to support her in labor.It is her choice th birth without medical attention. So it should fall on her shouldes if there is a problem.It would be similar to a situation where a couple doesn't make it to the hospital in time ( fast labor)and you end up catching the baby, as long as you tell them you are not a profesional and call 911 you are OK.
Not necessarily! The parents could quite easily turn around and sue you for not recognizing the problem and calling 911 sooner or something. People get sued for a lot less all the time. And I think it's impossible to predict what a parent might do when grieving the loss of a baby, so you can't really say "They would never sue me - I stayed within the scope of my practice!" And do you really want to have to defend yourself in court?
Not to mention is isn't exactly unassisted if they've got hired help (doula) there....
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Originally Posted by UtahDoula
Not necessarily! The parents could quite easily turn around and sue you for not recognizing the problem and calling 911 sooner or something...
This is the reason why many doulas will not agree to attend a UC. I think that as much as we all love birth, it's probably safe to say that most of us would love to be there to see a UC, but it's against our better judgement.
You're doing the right thing in my opinion, by not assisting her. This is exactly where the lines get kinda fuzzy and who knows what can happen legally? Unassisted is unassisted, and a doula is a "Birth Assistant".
There are some great posts here and what a great topic!
I think you can be charged with practicing medicine without a license. At any rate I'm sure she can find a homebirth midwife. Maybe she doesn't want to spend the out of pocket money because her insurance doesn't cover midwifery. Who knows?
Not necessarily! The parents could quite easily turn around and sue you for not recognizing the problem and calling 911 sooner or something. People get sued for a lot less all the time. And I think it's impossible to predict what a parent might do when grieving the loss of a baby, so you can't really say "They would never sue me - I stayed within the scope of my practice!" And do you really want to have to defend yourself in court?
Not to mention is isn't exactly unassisted if they've got hired help (doula) there....
I agree to a point but parents could sue for anything . I think you can get sued anymore for looking at someone funny.I wasn't saying that you could not get sued if you stay within the scope of practice, I was saying that from a legal stand point it would be proven that you were not responsible.Parents can lash out at the wrong person in times of grief but that could be anyone of us at any time. I feel that at any point in time a parent could try and sue a Doula for anything. If you were laboring in their home with them and not everything went right, you missed a problem, or any number of other circumstances. They could even try to sue if things did not go right in a hospital, saying that you were supposed to help. Whatever.....
That is why there should be a written agreement signed by the parents showing that they understand the scope of a Doula and that she is not to be held responsible for anything that happens during the delivery.
Make it clear that you are not medically trained to deliver babies and have it in writing.
I wouldn't want to have to defend myself in court but if I did nothing wrong then I would.
In my opinion it would still be unassisted because the Doula would not be assisting in the actual delivery.Maybe I am misunderstanding what unassisted means exactly. To me it seems it would be to deliver without a DR or Midwife. Someone that is trained to deliver.
I am not saying I would attend an unassisted birth as a Doula but If I did I would make sure my butte was covered by paper work.
No, I am not talking about paper panties. LOL
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Last edited by betterbirths; 04-28-2007 at 02:49 AM.
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I wouldn't be against attending a UC just because it was a UC. I would not be attending this woman however. The UCers I know are strong, educated women. They know what normal birth should be. They are willing to take responsibility for their choices (and educated in birth enough to know what consequences could be). In other words, they are able to weigh the risks vs. benefits and make an informed choice that is best for themselves and their families. This woman is not making an informed choice. And really, no matter what you or she signs, it is not usually the parents that sue. It is the District Attorny. Even if the parents are adament that you did nothing medical, you could still be sued by the DA.
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and if you do get sued keep in mind that even though there is a great possibility that you would not be found guilty it would still be crippling for your family to go through (and pay for) your defense.
I wouldn't attend a UC for all he legal reasons stated above. I would attend for a friend if she was doing UC, to help watch other children and run the house while she labored and gave birth.
Sounds to me like the mom is not about going UC, but is looking for a "cheap midwife".
Liz
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Quote:
I'd talk with her more probably. And, Rosy, is that pic of Jack? It's a beautiful picture 
This is the reason why many doulas will not agree to attend a UC. I think that as much as we all love birth, it's probably safe to say that most of us would love to be there to see a UC, but it's against our better judgement. 
